I'm back and looking for advice

[Mandolin]

Hi Everyone,

I haven't been on here in over a year now and a lot has changed (graduated from university, got married, among other things). As a recap, I am the current lovie mom to a very sweet hen, Kameko. But as we all know with most change there are some unwanted consequences. I am now working full time and as my husband works towards his Masters our little Kameko is getting less attention than she once did. Try as I might there are only so many hours in the day and the way our house is set up (with roommates) she can't have free run (not that I would anyway). So after many months of anxiety and stress on us all we have decided that she needs another bird for company. And even after being somewhat scolded from a breeder for telling her my situation I still this it is the best thing. We will still be giving both birds all of our love and available attention but it is just not what Kameko became accustomed to. If I sound like I am defending my self, I am because I feel bad.

Anyway, we have a breeder that will have dutch blue babies available after Christmas and we plan to bring one home. I just need a lot of advice. This is all new territory for me and I have obvious anxieties. The baby should be fully tame as she hand feeds and socializes all of her babies but I am still worried about Kameko going wild and not wanting to spend time with us anymore (i like giving her snuggles and head scratches as much as she enjoys getting them). So, as a result I have a million questions that I will pose to you guys and I am looking for any advice you can give me as I am in uncharted waters.

1) How do I keep them both happy, tame and wanting to spend time with us?
2) How many days of quarantine is necessary and what am I looking for during that time?
3) What is the best way to introduce them as Kameko hasn't seen another bird since she was 6 weeks old?
4) Is it true that Kameko and the baby can't share a cage until the baby is at least a year old because he or she will be picked on?
5) The baby will be weaned onto fruits, veggies, and pellets (no seeds) and Kameko is stubborn and with virtually only eat seeds, will watching the new bird eat other things help Kameko try new things or will the baby just want to eat seeds? Also, if I want to introduce pellets in advance to Kameko how do I teach her to eat them or even to know that they are food (sorry I know that is a whole new topic)?

Those aren't all of my questions but that is more than enough for one post. Thank you all very much for your help. I am happy to be back!

Mandy

PS. Who has a dutch blue lovie? I would love to see pictures so I know what to expect (I haven't seen pictures yet)

[linda040899]

Hi Mandy and welcome back! Good to see you here again and I'm glad you returned with your questions.

I, personally, believe that many birds enjoy having birdie companions. Some are fine with just human attention but a lot depends on the individual bird. With just a few exceptions, all of my birds have companions, even my personal pets. When I'm not around, they have each other. When I'm here, everyone enjoys socializing.

What keeps tame birds tame is attention. As you will find, with 2 lovebirds the attention level can be less, just as long as it's there every single day. Is Kameko a male or a female? If you don't know, it's time to find out. Mature males tend to accept younger females much easier/better than a mature hen will accept a younger male (or younger female, for that matter). Kameko's gender matters right now. If you have a male, I would be looking for another male, simply because male x female = offspring. Ask the breeder to DNA sex the baby you will be getting so that you know the gender. The cost of the test will be added to purchase price, unless the baby can be genetically sexed. You want DNA sexing, as pelvic sexing, especially in young birds, is not accurate.

In the wild, lovebirds are seed eaters and they need a diet that consists of at least 50% seed everyday. Pellets are actually too much nutrition and a diet of all pellets and fresh food can lead to death by kidney failure. This is per my avian vet. The diet of small birds should not contain more than 40% pellets, max.

Quarantine should be a minimum of 30 days and that's for Kameko's safety. After that, put their cages side by side so they can get to know each other.

Hope this is helpful.

[Mandolin]

Thank you very much Linda. Kameko is definitely a hen as she has laid eggs on a few occasions. She is 3 and half years old now. That is great to know about the pellet diet. If that is the case I am hoping there will be some learning for both birds when it comes to eating habits. I am not sure if the breeder will DNA sex the bird but it is something I can ask. It is nice to hear from another bird lover that I am not abandoning my bird and taking the easy route by getting another one. Kameko is still out hanging out with us whenever we can at least 3 or 4 times a day (she screams enough to make sure we do not forget about her). We just thought that we are not going to be getting more time as we go on in life, in fact we will be getting less as we have even more demanding jobs and eventually children.

[bookworm0550]

honestly, I think having a bird friend for kameko is fine. I think she would appreciate having another bird there, as long as it's not substituting for you. I'm sure you're aware that having two birds is twice the work and attention. I don't judge you or anything, but I can see why the breeder was upset. I mean, if you don't have the attention to give to your bird, how are you going to find time for another? You know what I mean? I'm not trying to be harsh, but I can see that point of view. And I understand yours too, that perhaps your bird is lonely and might like a friend of its' own kind. Which, I think she would. It's very obvious you care about her a lot.

I hope I'm not being harsh or anything. I totally understand you. That was one my reasons why I got Joey his sister. I think he was lonely when I was gone all day and would not stray from me when I got home. I felt bad for the guy. I thought about it for a long time. Am I doing the right thing? Will I have enough time for two birds? What is he going to do when I have classes all day? He need something besides me. My boyfriend isn't over enough for him to have another person around. When I do have those 12 hour days, what the heck is my baby going to do? I've read about how wrong it is to buy another bird cuz you think your bird is lonely, so forth and so on, and in the end, i really weighed the pros and cons of it. So I got another bird. It's only been 3 days and so far, so good. He seems very delighted at having company, someone to chirp back at him, to preen him, etc... The new bird is happy that she's not the only bird in the house. And I'm happy they have each other when I'm gone.

Do you plan on housing them together?

I don't know much about introducing birds though. But I'm sure you'll find stuff on here. I've always read to introduce them slowly.

How I got Joey to eat his veggies were to keep putting it in front of him. Sometimes I'd even take a bite so he could see that it's food. You just have to be consistent in putting that food there. You have know no idea how many veggies and apples I've gone through!!! I've wasted so much money, but it was worth it in the end when he gets excited over his veggies.

good luck :)

[Mandolin]

Thank you for your advice. Just to clear up any confusion, I really hope it doesn't seem like we actually are trying to replace ourselves with another bird. While I was in university I would be home for most of the day, generally gone only for a few hours during the day. Kameko would have someone with her for 90% of the day since she was 6 weeks old and now that I am working it is all different. I am gone from 8:15 am to at least 4:45 pm and she is by herself. When I get home she is practically ready to explode with a need for attention (and I don't blame her). She gets to come out when I get home but I have to make dinner so she can't be on me like she would like. For the rest of the evening she gets tons of attention but she is so stressed and wound up from being alone all day that our hang out time isn't always the most relaxing for either of us. We want to bring in another bird so she at the very least has someone to chat with during the day then join the party in the evening and on weekends. If I am wrong for thinking this way please let me know. Most of you have more experience than me with birds and I would love to know if this is a bad idea. I have spent many nights worrying about this and I only want what is best for her. I wouldn't want to be stuck in a room all day with some toys without anyone to talk to so i think she has to feel the same way.

To answer your question Bookworm, we would like to house them together if possible but we are planning to play everything by ear and see how they get along.

Have any of you had a single bird and introduced them to a baby before? How did that go for you? Did the baby get picked on?

[LauraO]

Hey Mandy! I'm glad to see you and Kameko back! It sounds like you've given this some thought and it's not a spur of the moment feel good decision, which makes great sense.

Of course, both birds will still need daily attention and out of the cage time but they may really learn to love one another. My only concern is the age difference between the two birds. I have 28 lovebirds and have had many more off and on through the years and older hens don't do well with younger males. If you get a baby, it may become annoying to Kameko and effect any long term relationship they may build. I also agree that getting a DNA test is essential if you ever plan housing the birds together.

While having a baby is always fun, have you given any thought to getting an older male? If you look around, you will find some great fids looking for a new home and Kameko will likely take to an older male much faster. I know their are some other canadian members that may have some suggestions.

DNA tests are simple and can be done with feathers. Any responsible breeder should be open to it.


Good luck and keep us updated:)

[bookworm0550]

no, i dont think you are wrong in thinking about this at all whatsoever. Play things by ear and see how things turn out. if anything, they can be neighbors and not roommates if they don't get along

[Mandolin]

Thank you both very much for your advice. Sadly living in the north (northern BC) I haven't had much luck finding breeders around us. I know of some in the rest of BC that are willing to ship but we will be looking for that in January and it is definitely cold and I would worry about a little bird like that traveling in the winter. We had plans to pick up a 6 month old lovie (not sexed yet) from Nanaimo but now that we are flying instead of driving so I don't think that would work anymore. We are very open to an older bird as long as it is tame. I just happened to find this breeder within a few hours of us and she has offered to drive the little guy/girl straight to our home. Let me know if you know of any other options that would be safe and efficient for all parties, or even another breeder.

So, is it best to be looking for a male? Kameko is such a nesty hen (we are on about a year straight of nesting behaviour without eggs) I am sure the first chance she got she would be trying to make "real" babies. I also know that two nesty hens are a bad combination. I am really in a pickle and am starting to think that this is a no win situation (except obviously welcoming a new flock member).

Housing the two birds isn't at all a necessity (though it would be nice), we were planning to have them separate until the baby was a year on recommendation of another breeder anyway. So, if they can only be playmates and not roommates that's fine, at least they would both have someone to talk to.

[linda040899]

Hi Mandy,
Since Kameko is a known hen, your only option is a male. While female/female pairs can work out very well, finding that special hen may or may not happen with the first hen you bring home. Older male would be preferable but it's not mandatory as long as you understand that Kameko may very well not be accepting of him while they are out of their cages until he's close to the age of sexual maturity (6-8 months). Side by side cages for companionship while you are gone would still work, as long as Kameko can't get close enough to hurt him while he's still in the "too young" stage.

Older males seem to accept much younger females more times than the other way around. I'm glad you know Kameko's gender so your search will be easier. Any reputable breeder should be willing to DNA sex as long as you are the one who is paying for the test. When I do it and I'm looking for a specific gender, I usually sent in 3 different samples in hopes that one comes back with the gender I'm looking for. I only charge for one test, as I'm only selling one bird. When I sell the other 2 DNA sexed birds, the cost of the sexing is charged to whoever buys those birds.

[LauraO]

Mandy: I think you are right about Kameko being a willing nesty hen who will quickly shack up and make babies. However, babies doesn't sound like something your are wanting or needing at this time. I personally boil all my eggs and return them to the hen as soon as they are laid. This doesn't hurt anything it just keeps the egg from developing into a chick and something that works really well for me. I know some folks are uncomfortable with this, but I thought it might be something you might want to think about ahead of time.

I have to boil eggs for 1) My birds would hatch out like 80% of the 50 or so eggs that are laid two to three times a year and 2) I am not a breeder and don't want to deal with all the emotion that comes for me in finding good homes.

:)

[luluxoxo83]

I have a Dutch Blue Lovie. Her name is Sky! Good Luck!

http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j265/luvbug0883/MomUnclePepeVisit133.jpg

[cp.lovebird]

Here is a pic of my dutch blue lovie who sadly passed away last year:

http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c290/PharmTech/FebruarytoMay2007029.jpg

[lemonypickett]

Jess,

What is that ring of light colored feathers around her neck?

Christine,

What a stunning pic of Blue Meanie. Colors are so vivid. Gotta love that little piece of tucked paper!

[lemonypickett]

Bookworm...

What will happen if Joey and his sis make babies?

[bookworm0550]

uh, let's hope they don't make babies though that thought has crossed my mind. Gosh, I don't know. My boyfriend thinks I should hand raise the babies if that happens. I don't know, there's just something off about that idea of them mating....maybe cuz i'm human. I wonder if that applies to the bird world??? Anyone know? Eventually I want to get them real mates, but I don't know if that's a good or bad idea....I don't know how all this even works. Maybe I should start a new thread huh?

[bookworm0550]

if they do mate, will their babies be ok? i'm more worried about that...I could just boil eggs or replace them w/ dummy eggs.

[LauraO]

uh, let's hope they don't make babies though that thought has crossed my mind. Gosh, I don't know. My boyfriend thinks I should hand raise the babies if that happens. I don't know, there's just something off about that idea of them mating....maybe cuz i'm human. I wonder if that applies to the bird world??? Anyone know? Eventually I want to get them real mates, but I don't know if that's a good or bad idea....I don't know how all this even works. Maybe I should start a new thread huh?

There is no reason to let your birds breed, and handfeeding is NOT easy and can result in a bunch of problems. I boil my lovies' eggs and this works well as it's very sad and difficult to find good homes for birds.

[luluxoxo83]

Linda,
I honestly coud not tell you what the ring around her neck is? I guess its just different colored feathers she got. Is it a bad thing?

[luluxoxo83]

opps sorry that message was for lemonypicket

[bookworm0550]

no, i don't plan on breeding them at all whatsoever, but i do think about it in case anything does happen. always prepare!!! most likely i'll boil the eggs or something. i'd be worried about finding good homes

[lemonypickett]

Someone who knows may chime in. I haven't seen a ring of different colored feathers like that before.