some taming advice

[DallyTsuka]

ive had my two a little over 2 months. been attempting to tame them.... mango is shy but gentle and doesnt seem to mind sitting with me if its just me. he doesnt shake, hes recently enjoyed my shoulder and likes to play with my hair and earings. hes slow at taming, but hes gotten progress.

munch... shes a different story. shes VERY independent. ive tried many times to tame her. i spend time with her, talk to her, just let her hang out on my laptop with me. if im near the cage she lunges and throws a tantrum, i cant fix or add toys easily as i always get away needing band aids. she will not take treats from my hand without chomping my fingers, she shakes really bad when shes with me, and when i attempt to have both out with me, she makes mango shake too! theres VERY little progress with her. most progress ive had with her is her stopping biting me when i change food and water from OUTSIDE of the cage (cant do it inside). ive removed her mirror and her sleeping tube. she has calmed down temper wise but each day i get to add more bandaids on my hand. she bites down hard and doesnt let go. she makes me bleed each time and she seems terrified of me, after all this time still. i truly think she is unhappy with taming, more so than the average bird. i want her to just be happy, i dont need her to be tame. i just thought taming may be nice to be her friend so shes not so bad being in a cage alone, even if mango's cage is right next to hers. mango and her are siblings and in case theyre opposite gender, i dont want breeding. that and munch beats mango up and i feel bad for him. theyre getting a new cage once my dad is done building it for them. its a divider cage. they can be with eachother without breeding and keeps mango safe. they get out of cage time together with everyone....

if shes happier being untame, is that best? shes got all the toys she can ask for, out of cage time, she can see all the other birds, i talk to her, she gets treats, her favourite foods (carrots!) every day, she gets lots of foot toys as she loves them, a cage in front of the window to watch all the other birds since she REALLY loves that. do you think, for her happiness, that i should just let her be as she is, an untame little bugger who likes to bite? the biting when im fixing toys i wish would stop. she chases me down :omg: so would she be happy as she is, with that living condition? she just seems scared of me and i dont want her to be and if its gonna scare her that bad to be tamed and make her that unhappy... id rather her be happy. any advice?

[michael]

..........if shes happier being untame, is that best? shes got all the toys she can ask for, out of cage time, she can see all the other birds, i talk to her, she gets treats, her favourite foods (carrots!) every day, she gets lots of foot toys as she loves them, a cage in front of the window to watch all the other birds since she REALLY loves that. do you think, for her happiness, that i should just let her be as she is, an untame little bugger who likes to bite? the biting when im fixing toys i wish would stop. she chases me down :omg: so would she be happy as she is, with that living condition? she just seems scared of me and i dont want her to be and if its gonna scare her that bad to be tamed and make her that unhappy... id rather her be happy. any advice?

Hi DallyTsuka. .. Thanks for sharing so many details about your two new lovebirds. .. At only two months, it sounds to me like their beginning to settle in quite well. .. In regards to food, housing, toys, socialization, these are not only the basics for building a relationship with your birds, but irregardless of the level of bond you eventually form with them, those basics are what helps to keep them happy as well. ... As for taming Munch down a bit, just like in the wild, her instincts to protect her home and flock are what give her meaning in life. ... As long as you provide all the ammenities, i'm sure she'll feel right at home. .. Also too, the fact that we've had many members report a positive change in behavior after one/two or more years, certainly leaves you and Munch plenty of time to work together... Although ultimately it may be more than difficult to change her defensive behavior, by finding ways to redirect or work around it, both you, her, and Mango, can still be very happy lovebirds.

For now, both Munch and Mango sound like relatively young lovebirds. .. If this is the case, once they fully mature, hormones could play a key role in how they interact with other flock mates, including you. .. To help get a heads up on how hormones and other factors can influence behavior, it may be a good idea to review our behavior and taming forum, and our breeding forum as well. .. Whats important now, is that you eliminate the opportunity for Munch to continue biting. .. Have you utilized a wooden dowel for "step ups"? .. Can you spend time with her in an area thats farther away from her cage? .. How about bathing/misting? .. Sometimes one or two alternative methods alone can relieve quite a bit of tension. .. You know, one thing that caught my attention was having her cage near a window. .. While it may appear Munch enjoys the view, it could be cause for excess anxiety in a sense where she always feels threatened. .. The only way to guage that anxiety, is to experiment by moving her cage to a more secure area. .. If its helps calm her a bit, you could always try setting up a playgym or stand by the window instead of her cage. .. Either way, the more she gets used to her new environment, the better chance her curiosity for social activities will eventually get the best of her. .............:)

[DallyTsuka]

the cage was moved to the window and it did calm her a bit. she hasnt been AS bad while by the window. ive tried the dowel perch. she runs away from it every time. she steps up only onto a glove. ONLY a glove. theyre 5 months old. sad thing is, munch was handfed because she was the runty baby and was being trampled. mango was the oldest sibling and was parent raised. i think the problem started with the person i got them from. though she handfed munch, she also didnt have them step up. she said she handled them to get them used to people but when i went to get them, she just reached in and grabbed them. and they were scared of her. im assuming thats how she "handled" them.... so now theyre scared of hands :(

and away from cage in another room gives the same results. she seems terrified of me and she just shakes badly :( i dont want to keep putting her through that all the time, just to get a friendly with people lovebird. if shes truly happy the way she is and not being hand tame, i am quite happy with that. as i said, i just want her to be happy. thats our main goal in the flock. we just want them happy.

her cage may be in front of a window, but most of the day (morning and night when its coolest) the curtains (a dark blanket) is down over the window to protect from drafts. during the warmer afternoon the curtains are up for her. so shes not seeing out the window 24/7.

[linda040899]

Being a breeder myself, I can tell you there's more to what happened at the breeder's facility than you will ever know. Munch was never socialized properly and bad handling by the breeder has made her fearful of hands. I have some hand fed/human socialized young lovebirds that aren't handled too much right now but none of them shake or are fearful of me when I pick them up. (Some step up, while others don't.)

Back off a little bit and follow her lead. If she sees Mango socializing with you, it will catch her attention, even if you don't notice it right away. Birds learn from each other so let Mango do the teaching. Trust doesn't happen overnight, especially if distrust was learned early on in life. She's very cage territorial and that's something you may not be able to change or even modify. She reminds me a lot of a Turquoise Peachie I had yrs ago that was named Cookie. I affectionately called her Cookie Monster because she truly was! She was the world's worst mother and it seemed that her entire existence was to lay eggs and bite the hand that fed her!! In the yrs that she was with me, she was never super hand tame but we came to an agreement. In return for my fingers not being mutilated, I would respect her and her space. It wasn't until she got much older that she decided she didn't mind being human friendly.

Go with the flow and let Munch call the shots. You will find that you two will develop some kind of relationship. Just what has yet to be determined but see where it all takes you. All live creatures will respond to love, kindness and patience. :)

[DallyTsuka]

i love munch very much. most people wouldnt keep a bird like her. shes got personality for sure and i love it so much because shes got a strong personality unlike any other creature ive ever met. if she wants to just be like she is, thats okay with me. shes entitled to the same right as all my others are. she'll occasionally play with a toy if i hold it out to her.... so there is hope, but shes scared of hands. ill keep working with mango and maybe soon she'll be okay with me. even if she never is, she has a home with people who love her. so its not the end of the world

[linda040899]

Munch reminds me a lot of Ginger, my CAG. I've had her since 1991, when I bought her and her late mate at a bird show. I was just getting into birds and didn't know much but the price was good so I brought them home. She and her late mate are imports so there was no expection of tame in any sense of the word. My plan was to let them breed and keep at least one baby for myself.

Well, you know what they say about the best laid plans. Mine didn't materialize and Ginger ended up becoming one of my personal pets. She still isn't hand tame but she loves to interact with me. She will follow me all over the house and carry on just to get my attention. She doesn't talk but that's OK with me. I love her for exactly who/what she is and there's no amount of money that I would accept for her.

[DallyTsuka]

a lot of people dont understand those pets. they want a parrot to be tame and talk and have rediculous expectations of them

[linda040899]

Lack of owner education is the biggest problem with parrots. Many fail to realize that a parrot is very different than a cat or a dog and just because they've seen parrots do things that they think are neat, they expect theirs to do the same thing. Not!

About 2 yrs ago, a breeder from West Palm Beach gave me a male CAG, Sonny. Sonny doesn't want to breed. He wants to be a pet and, thankfully, the breeder was sensitive to that. Sonny is still a bit skiddish but I can handle him, unlike Ginger. He likes people and he's made no attempt to pair up with Ginger and Ginger has not shown any interest in Sonny, which is all well and good with me. Everyone is happy and so am I!

[DallyTsuka]

ive grown up with cats and still have cats. id never owned a bird because my mom hated them


so when i got dally, well i was a new owner that knew nothing lol i knew not to expect talking. it didnt matter to me. i wanted a cockatiel for the cuddliness and friendliness. dally was handfed and very gentle. we got tsuka to give dally a friend and he can talk better than he whistles lol. its nice and fun to hear, but thats all bonus things. i always told myself i wouldnt get lovebirds lol but the lady couldnt sell these two and they werent in the best conditions so we took them in. the lady smoked around them, let her dog lick them, welded a clothes hanger wire onto the cage where a bar was missing (parents cage), had these two in a tiny antique cage, and obviously mistreated them. i couldnt say no. i dont regret it, ive actually fell in love with the bold personalities and i can confidently say, they won me over and i will definately always have a lovebird as a pet after these two. i can still wonder why the average person who wants a bird for their kid would get a lovebird. yes, theyre colourful to look at, but theyre noisy, they dont have pretty voices or sing or talk.... and the biting factor. i dont get why people get them for their kids!!! they are not for kids... a kids bird (the responsible kid) would be a female cockatiel... not a nippy unpredictable lovie or hormonal male tiel! makes it very hard to cuddle with them lol our male tiel is so hormonal and nippy lol hes got attitude that almost rival's munch's. he didnt come from a good background either. dally was handfed and socialized and came from a good breeder :) but i pity the birds in bad homes, which is where im more likely to get a pet rather than a store... though i pity birds at some stores... our petsmart isnt so bad with the birds there. theyre cared for, played with, customers can hold them and play with them, they get toys, cages are clean, food and water are fresh... i cant complain too much about our petsmart. theyre not that bad compared to others ive heard about. the worst one in our area is disgusting. birds, cats, dogs, rabbits, fish... theyre all sick, they sell turtles too small to be legal, theyre in crowded conditions, the cages they sell are rusty, the place is dirty... ugh i went in there once and i felt grimy and gross! >: and coming from a person with 4 birds, 4 cats, and 2 chinchillas as well as a fiance all under one roof and im not the most organized person.... thats sad!