4 week old lovebird help!! :)

[karsa624]

Hi! i havent posted here in a very long time, but need some advice quite a lot right now and knew this was the best place to post to! Ben and jerry are doing fine, we have a love hate relationship as ben is still undecided on my fingers!
On monday my brother found one of the lovebird chicks kicked out the nest in the aviary at work, he was sat on the floor and my brother tried to put him back in the nest box but he wouldnt go back in, and the mum was also having none of it, so he knew it must of been disowned, my brother doesnt know how long he had been kicked out for as he was off all weekend, so be bought him home and we started taking care of him, we think he's round 4-5 week as he's got most of his feathers just not his neck and his chest and tail are slowly growing (he has a bright orange on his chest :)) he is also flapping his wings and flying in straight lines/jumpy flys, the day he bought him home he was pretty hungry, we found a rearing forumula (after searching ages for it) he didnt like the syringe and preferrred eating off a spoon and our finger, he ate quite a bit in the evening. But yesterday and today he's not eaten as much we've had to coax him a little to eat it and he would eat some bits, but also discovered he likes eating millet! he ate some this morning but not much, (which also makes me think he might be round 5-6 weeks instead) he's energetic (exploring my bed and climbing the bars of the cage much to my dislike and panic!) he is sleeping a lot but we know he's not had much sleep and he's alert and aware of his surroundings, he is also pooping quite a bit so we know the food is going through his system.
Would just like some advice on how to get him to eat a bit more as we dont think its enough, we are feeding him every 3-4 hours at the moment as we dont think he's had much to eat in the last few days even though he ate quite a bit the first day
He's also not tweeting even though he did answer back when i tried some lovebird chick sounds on youtube to see if it would coax him to eat.
I'm also a bit worried about his weight, he weighs 36g as of last night, and to me i think thats a bit low.
He doesnt seem depressed or anything but he seems a bit lost even though he's got a cheeky and stubborn personality :) when he doesnt get what he wants. I havent had any experience in a lovey this young but im positive he's a strong little soul! ben and jerry are also very curious and trying to communicate, they were staring at each other through the bars yesterday (he's in a separate cage with lots of warm bedding and found a little teddy for him to cuddle up to which he likes, we've also been putting some food and bit of water in for him to see if he would take it by himself but he doesnt seem fussed), he's definitely warm every time i go to say hello aswell, he's a green fischer well as far as i know, red beak, green feathers and a orange chest, i have read that the black on a beak indicates how old they are before adult but strangely enough he has hardly any black on his beak but the colouring of his beak at the top hasnt come through yet (a bit like bits of nail polish chipped off at the top of your nail best example i could think of!)
Any advice on caring for this little one and making sure he survives would be very much appreciated! i will try and get a better picture of him as the one i have isn't very good, so you can determine what age he is, thanks so much :D

[linda040899]

Kudos to you for being willing to take care of this baby!

If you can post a photo of his front and another of his entire back, including tail feathering, I should be able to tell you fairly accurately how old he is. It sounds like he's between 5-6 weeks but a photo would be most helpful.

I have a feeling that you may be feeding him too often and he's not hungry because he's eating millet. Try the hand feeding formula every 5-6 hrs and see if it makes a difference. Keep giving him millet and try adding small seeds for him to try. Millet DOES have nutritional value and it's helping to keep him alive right now. If he's a Fischer's, your formula is probably too cool. Using a thermometer (meat thermometers are good for this), make sure the feeding temperature is between 108F and 110F. Fischer's like their food warmer and it can/will affect their appetites if the formula is under 108F. This is not hot enough to burn the crop buy make sure you check temp with the thermometer.

[karsa624]

Thanks so much for the quick advice! I wouldn't of forgiven myself if we had just left him there, and i have become quite attached to it, all of us have! my brother has turned into mother hen! We tried a feed again and we made the formula warmer he took a small interest but didnt seem hungry enough so we're gunna try him at 2pm-3pm instead (im in the EU), he was more intent on running off! or falling asleep against my pillow! he took a big flight jump off my brothers leg and landed nicely so he's starting to flutter a bit more, i've just ordered a food thermometer as we dont actually have one! but he's happily preening away right now, but he knows where his safe spot is as he tries to go back in the cage by himself. And i finally managed to get some pictures! he did some nice poses for me! its mainly around his neck when he stretches his neck where his feathers have only just started coming through.tried to get a good enough picture of his tail feathers too.

http://i884.photobucket.com/albums/ac44/karsa624/crossstitch186.jpg
this is a little blurry but his tail feather are round where his wings end
http://i884.photobucket.com/albums/ac44/karsa624/crossstitch184.jpg
http://i884.photobucket.com/albums/ac44/karsa624/crossstitch190.jpg did a nice pose for me here!

[linda040899]

Cute little guy! :)

Based on your photos of his tail feathering, he's between 4.5 - 5 weeks old. The tail feathers are the last ones to grow to full length and he's getting there but he's at least a week out on that growth. He's capable of eating 8 cc/feeding 3 times/day but his weight is good and he's not that far from beginning to wean (age 6 weeks) that he may or may not eat that much at each feeding. Warmer formula is an absolute must.

Based on feather color, he's a cross between Masked and Fischer's. His head feathering is darker than a pure Fischer's so that's where the Masked is showing up. Regardless, he will make a great pet and, as you see, it's so very, very easy to lose your heart to one of these little ones!!!! Since eye-ring species are smaller than Peachfaced, the 36 gram weight is good for him. When you weigh him, do it before he eats first thing in the morning. That will be his true weight. Food in the crop doesn't count as body weight........ :)

[karsa624]

awhh thankyou so much! You've eased all of my worries! Me, mum and brother are relieved he's a good weight as was slightly worried but thats wonderful :) i did wonder the tail feathers were a bit small but he's cute ^^ and very fluffy he's happy enough to let us stroke him, he fell asleep sat on my mums chest yesterday! and has a thing for my brothers leg hair!, we're going to try a timed routine of 3 times a day feeding starting tomorrow 8am, 2pm then 8pm to get him in a routine and buildup a appetite.
He was in a aviary so that would explain the cross also! but he's cute specially his bright orange chest just growing out the feather shafts! definitely i've really lost my heart to him i had a tough last couple of weeks and he has totally taken away the thoughts of all the bad things so its lovely! I will keep you updated on his progress :) i just came in the bedroom after telling my brother the good news to see him climbing the bars of the cage! so he's got a burst of energy, but Benji was being naughty and opening his beak towards him from the other cage! so he got told off! Thankyou again :)

[linda040899]

Three times/day may or may not be enough for him, depending on how much he eats each time and how much he can eat on his own. At this age, he can't eat enough to keep himself alive so it's important to weigh him every morning at the same time, if possible. You're going to have to take your clues from him and he should be just fine.

He's adorable sounds like he's settling in just fine and doing what baby lovies do best.....making humans into devoted slaves after they steal our hearts!

[karsa624]

yeah i was thinking that as he isnt eating much every time we feed him, we're having to coax him to feed by putting it at the side of his beak and encouraging him too, he hasnt eaten any food on his own as i've noticed we've put some crushed seed and some millet in his cage for him but he's not bothered, but i dont think he's settled in properly yet either he still seems a bit nervous, but we were thinking of feeding him every 4-5 hours instead of 3, but your right just have to keep an eye on how much he eats as he's hardly eaten anything today, he had a few millet seeds this morning but thats been pretty much it as we've fed him twice so far today and trying again at 3. I'll be heartbroken if he doesnt survive but im hoping he will.

[linda040899]

The biggest problem you are facing is that he isn't familiar with hand feeding formula so he doesn't really recognize it as food and he's not reached the point of being hungry enough to eat anything that's offered to him. Spoon feeding is your best option, as it's closest to how mom's beak feels. The syringe is completely foreign. If you happen to have a plastic teaspoon, heat the bowl of the spoon to where you can take and gently bend up the sides of the bowl so the formula stays more to the center of the spoon. That will also make the tip he's eating from fell more like mom's beak. Again, I can't stress how important the temperature is. At age 5 weeks, he's not ready to think about feeding himself so you are going to have to play with the feedings to see what works. Daily weight checks are very important, too, as you don't want to see much of a weight loss, if any. A loss of a gram or so may not be able to be helped but you want to know what's going on with his eating. Weight is the way to monitor it.

[karsa624]

Thats a great idea! have to go on the hunt for a plastic spoon sure we have one in the house. We have just bought the exact feeding formula off a site aswell as we found our feeding formula is quite lumpy and seedy and not like the ones ive seen in videos (which is quite pasty and smooth)and he doesn't seem bothered i do live in a small town though and the range of pet shops is extremely small, the first day we had him he ate loads of the stuff we had, licking spoon for ages, it was what the guy in the pet shop recommended for 4-5 week olds, we just tried him again and he only ate a tiny bit of millet spitting most of it out and kept turning his head away from the mixture we had and it was very warm aswell, he's hardly eaten anything all day :/ yesterday he didn't do too bad but today's not been good. The guy we've bought the exact formula from is posting it first class recorded for us this evening so we should hopefully have it tomorrow morning, we've going to try feeding him again in a bit as he's pratically had nothing, it's frustrating us all :( UPDATE: because we dont have a thermometer we stuck the little food bowl in a small bowl of boiling water to keep the food warm and a good temperature and he's devouring it!! happily sat in my mums hand! now found a way to keep it warm ! thank goodness! just hope that thermometer comes soon! :)

[linda040899]

Thank you for adding the update! Turns out that temperature was the problem! I was really getting worried and I'm editing my post to remove my suggestion of seeing an avian vet! ~whew~

[karsa624]

Yeah i got upset because he hadnt eaten! and mum was determined to try again! always get mums help! she cuddled him with a big furry ruggy then had the idea of the bowl of boiling water and the mixture got warmer! and he started licking it off the spoon and off her hands aswell, then he was quite content to sit in her hands sat on the furry ruggy! hopefully that thermometer comes soon but its brilliant as mum said its just like with human babies and it has to be hot for them :) hopefully he'll start putting weight on now! I'll still keep you updated on his day to day progress and his weight also seeming as we know now how to get him to eat :) thats made my day!

[karsa624]

Thought i'd give a small update on Narney's (yes we called him narney coz he likes banana :) ) progress as its been a couple of days, we got the exact feeding formula in the post and he now munch's like a monster! he's eating loads now and im making sure its nice and hot for him as have a thermometer now, and he absolutely loves it! he's eating round 14g of the mixture in total for the day, so round 2/3/4g feeds everytime, I weighed him first thing in the morning yesterday and he's actually 27g :/ which seems extremely low, but we think he might of lost some coz we struggled getting him to eat the first couple of days but now he's got a appetite im sure it will go up! his tail feathers are growing like lightning they've become quite long! and he loves climbing in his cage but he knows he shouldnt when he see's that we saw him! as we dont want him falling!, he's also practising on a wooden perch with his balance which is nice :) i've mixed some seed into the formula when i feed him to get him a bit used to solids and letting him pick it up and play around with it in his mouth to get used to it which is going well!, he's a strong little trooper! :)

[linda040899]

Glad to hear that Narney is eating so well for you! One thing I've learned about baby birds. They want what they want and it's up to us to figure it out... :)

27grams is a bit on the light side but, considering the fact that he didn't eat well for a couple of days, it's acceptable. Now that he's eating much better, watch for a weight gain with no loss at all. Full size for him could easily be in the 39 - 42 gram weight range. His size/weight will be dependent on his lineage. If his parents were small lovebirds, I would not expect to ever see him weigh more than 50 grams, as his genetics just aren't there for that kind of body mass.

If he's climbing around and exercising his wings, he might surprise you one of the days soon to come by flapping those wings and becoming airborn!

[karsa624]

yeah exactly! he wolfs it down every meal!

I weighed him first thing this morning to see if he had put on any weight after a full day yesterday of the exact formula and he's now 29g!!! put on two grams coz of yesterday :D so hoping to see it as 31g tomorrow! but he knows when he's finished as he just walks off haha like he's saying 'yeah thanks for the grub cya later' haha. I'm not too sure about the size of his parents ill have to ask my brother, but i now know he was actually kicked out the nest as his mum still has two chicks in the nest, so poor Narney must off been the smallest and weakest possibly, but he's got us loving mothers :)

he's tried some jumpy flys, but he thinks he can jump higher than he actually can and just ends up jumping straight upwards its so funny! but loves his wooden perch and is getting better at stepping up onto it! He has such a cheeky character :)

[linda040899]

Thumbs up to the weight gain! You may not see a 2 gram gain each day but I would expect even a small gain or maintain. As he gets closer to age 6 weeks, he will decide he likes eating more on his own so he will take less from you. Once that starts, you can also expect to see a slight weight drop and it's because he slimming down a bit so he can fly more efficiently so this is perfectly normal, too.

Parent raised babies are usually out of the nest at age 6 weeks and learning to eat on their own. Their parents have them just about completely weaned at age 8 weeks, although they will give "snacks" if the babies want them. With hand fed, it can take anywhere from 9-12 weeks to wean off formula, sometimes longer. It all depends on the level of confidence the baby has in its own eating ability. I've seen completely weaned chicks at age 7 weeks but those are the huge exception rather than the rule. I tend to watch a youngster that young who is refusing formula very carefully to make sure they get enough to eat.

[karsa624]

He's now 36 grams this morning and looks like a proper bird now! His tail feathers have grown really long and his chest is mostly grown out including his wings, and he's very flighty now! not fully flying but pretty darn close! he's round over 6 weeks now and he is taking less from me when i feed him formula (including being quite fidgety!), and has taken a big interest in his seed bowl (he was sat in it rummaging last night) and his millet spray (which he's taken to using as a perch instead of his ACTUAL perch :) ), he now gets fed 4 times a day at 5 hour intervals and is still putting on weight, main thing is to watch his weight? as tad worried he's not eating much but keep trying to remember he's at that age now!

He's just spent the last 5 minutes trying to open a sunflower seed and half succeeded :clap , but he is taking a big interest in seed now (also i think because ben and jerry like to chuck it in his cage and let him know its something to eat!) I'll take some more pictures to let you see how he looks now!

[linda040899]

Sounds like he's doing just fine! :) As he takes a bigger interest in food other than formula, it's natural that he will want to eat more by himself than accept food from you. As this happens, simply adjust feeding schedule and he will eat what he needs. His interest in his seed will also extend to other food so now is the time to introduce fresh vegetables, sprouts or any other kind of food you would like him to eat. Shredded fresh carrot, small pieces of broccoli, sprouted seed and homemade cornbread are my own personal top choices.

You're doing a great job with him! :) Thanks for the update.

[karsa624]

He cracked his first sunflower seed open at lunchtime :) eventually... took him a while of dropping it! but he finally did it! i did put some celery leaves in his cage (ben and jerry love them) and he wasn't fussed at all, but he's now starting to stand on his perch a bit more and i was thinking that the end of this week ill take his bedding out and get him used to a normal cage and put some more perch's in. not all of his bedding ofc :) definitely going to start trying him with some bannana which is something we first gave him when he was here. I did read about sprouted seed as its also softer so he might be more inclined to eat it.
He's also a lot more noisy ^^ was sat on my finger and was talking back to ben and jerry was incredibly cute :D he flew properly for the first time! jumped onto a cushion and flew towards the window and landed ungracefully on the floor but he seemed fine after :D

I feel like a very proud mother :D

[linda040899]

Watching a young bird learn how to fly is another experience that is nothing short of amazing! They just kind of lift off by accident and then gain confidence to flap those wings they've been exercising so strenuously! However, once airborne, they have to learn the fine art of landing and first attempts tend to be ungraceful, as you've seen. A baby bird should never have flight feathers clipped until they can take off/land expertly or they may never learn how to fly correctly. The reason is that babies have no fear, unlike their adult counterparts.

[karsa624]

As of today he can officially fly! Surprised me by flying to the curtain pole after i took his cage top off! he had a bit of a mad moment and flew absolutely everywhere in his excitement and went into the mirror on my wardrobe :omg::omg:, seemed completely fine after i picked him up and gave him a stroke so he started falling asleep in my hand instead. But he was alot more smoother this time just 5 minutes ago and was practising stepping up onto my finger on top of the curtain pole etc :) I dont think i will get his feathers clipped he's happy enough to step up to my finger i'd like him to have the freedom of flight. He's developed a keen interest in flying to ben and jerrys cage which i have to take him off as dont want ben biting his toes off!

He still cant quite get those sunflower seeds opening but keeps trying! still need to take some updated pictures! next mission = get him to like the camera!

[linda040899]

next mission = get him to like the camera!
:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:
Good luck on that! Just be careful that he doesn't learn to like it a bit too much!!!

[Z28Taxman]

:rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl::rofl:
Good luck on that! Just be careful that he doesn't learn to like it a bit too much!!!

Ditto loves my camera. The lens makes a great perch! :rofl: Kinda hard to get pictures that way except when he occasionally peeks over the edge and looks into the lens! :rotfl

[linda040899]

Ditto loves my camera. The lens makes a great perch! :rofl: Kinda hard to get pictures that way except when he occasionally peeks over the edge and looks into the lens! :rotfl
Exactly! Ditto was the lovie I was thinking about when I made my comment! :rofl:

[Emma Louise Oatez]

Not related to your questions at all, but just wanted to say he looks so cute! How adorable, I hope he continues to do well, sounds like you're all doing a great job :)

Emma

[Z28Taxman]

Exactly! Ditto was the lovie I was thinking about when I made my comment! :rofl:

Figured that. That's how I get flying pics of him. Snap 'em quick before he gets to the lens. :rofl: You'd think a big black camera would be scary but not to the Dittobird, he just thinks it's a $1,200 perch.:evil:

[karsa624]

still not had chance to take pictures! he's now become very rebellious of me, and has resulted in nipping alot with his beak (which when he grabs a bit of skin does hurt!), is this just a stage? or could it be some thing else entirely? like he's a pain to get to step up now aswell he'll just jump back off my finger or start trying to bite the skin on my finger (which he doesnt get away with) any skin he can grab he'll bite (including my face, he bit my forehead today!) sometimes he grabs onto the skin aswell and doesnt let go, i do tell him off but he's still doing it! specially when im trying to get him on my finger to take him out the cage aswell, think he's round...8 weeks now well almost, also when going into his cage to say hello and stroke him he starts squeaking (like he's panicing etc, or when i have to pick him up when he wont go back in his cage, he does it then aswell) is it a trust issue? or just the birds equivalent of 'teething'? , but other than that he's doing well he's now eating on his own even though im having to mix a bit of sloppy egg protein in his seed, and he's developed a interest in his seed bar in his cage which he has a good go at aswell!

[lovie_couple]

It's probably just a trust thing. My bird HATED to be touched when he was younger, and he'd make a weird screechy noise like you were causing him pain. He grew out of it though.

Yes your bird will bite. My bird went through an extremely bitey stage, but now has calmed down (somewhat) But expect them to nip at you if you do something they don't particularly like. Some people say to stroke their beak and calmly say no bite.

[linda040899]

This actually is not a trust issue but a matter of you asking him to do something he doesn't want to do. If he's out of his cage, you want him to go back and he's not ready, the only way he has to tell you is to bite. Or it could be the other way around. You want to take him out but he has something else in mind.

If he has a favorite treat, you may want to save it for things like coming out/returning to the cage. Whatever you choose, reserve it only to reinforce acceptable behavior. He's at a nippy/rebellious stage, too, so that doesn't help but know that parrots don't understand any kind of punishment (time outs in the cage, for instance) so you would be wasting time and energy.